Granite Countertops

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Questions about granite or granite countertops?

In the real world I am a production manager at a large company that templates, fabricates and installs granite countertops. I hope I can share my knowledge with you. If you don't find what you are looking for, just ask!

Thinking about getting granite countertops?

What you need to know, and the industry standards

How does the process of getting granite countertops installed work?

Like most people who are considering granite for their kitchen or bathroom, you probably have some questions. Let me try my best to help you if I can, and if there are any questions afterwards feel free to drop me a line

So then: how does it work? Well usually the whole thing starts with sitting down with a salesperson and getting a quote. The salesperson will go over all the preliminary details with you like which color you want and what edge profile you like best. If you have the sales representative come to your house they will often take measurements and create a little drawing. You may or may not receive a price quote immediately.

How much does it cost?

The price can vary on a number of factors. The first is the total square footage of your project. The second is the type of countertop you are considering. There are a number of options ranging from 1cm granite tiles, to 2cm slab granite, 2cm slab with a laminated edge (commonly called 4cm), 3cm slab granite, engineered stones (Cambria, Zodiaq, Silestone, Caesarstone, Hanstone etc), concrete slabs poured right over your existing tops, and the list goes on and on.

The price will be determined by the type of material you choose, and the cost of fabrication and installation. Also bear in mind that there will probably be plumbing that needs to be done afterwards and possibly electrical work. Most fabricators do NOT provide plumbing and electrical services because of liability issues.

Prices vary so much that it is difficult to generalize, but shop around and make sure you get a countertop with a LIFETIME WARRANTY, such as is offered by the Artisan Group.

What are the benefits?

Besides the obvious benefit of beautifying your home, a kitchen remodel with granite countertops can be one of the best things you can do to increase the value of your home. If properly maintained and sealed granite will last a lifetime and you will see (in most cases) a return on your investment of MORE than you spend in the long run.

What can I expect and what are the industry standards?

To make sure your fabricator is reputable ask if they are a member of the Better Business Bureau (BBB) or if they are a member of the Marble Institute of America. The Marble Institute of America, (MIA for short) is a type of governing body for stone fabricators much like the BBB is for businesses in general.
While in most cases your old countertops are going to be removed (and this can be an invasive process) there is likely to be some minor damage (ding in nearby drywall, or small dents) and some dust and noise during this process. It is good to be there while the install is taking place to answer questions and get a good look at the finished product; but try not to get in the way because granite is very heavy (17lbs per square foot for 3cm slab granite) and installers who get "watched over like vultures" tend to be more nervous and accident prone.

How are granite countertops produced?

Most companies employ the use of CNC machines to do the work. These machines have dropped in price significantly over the last few years, leading to lower prices in granite for the end user and myriads of new granite shops arising almost overnight.

After production the tops are usually finish polished and then sent out for install.

Am I REALLY buying granite?

Most stone is called "granite" in general, when in fact there are many different rocks and minerals in most slabs. It would be a nightmare to educate and indeed explain to everyone in the production chain about all of the variances, and for the most part they are insignificant to the end user. Most slabs have a close average weight, strength etc; and once the install is complete there will be few differences.

There are exceptions to this rule, however; especially when it comes to marble and travertine. Marble is easier to scratch and travertine is far more porous than most other stones; since it is a form of ancient coral. For more information on this feel free to ask.

What if I have a problem or issue after the fact that my fabricator won't help me with?

This is where it is important to have a reliable fabricator who is a member of the BBB and preferably the MIA. These two governing bodies can help to mitigate such problems should the situation arise where an agreement cannot be reached with your fabricator.
Other resources are also availible, such as asking the members of a popular online forum, The Stone Advice Forum, located here.

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Choosing a sink for your new granite countertops

Materials, Design, Application

Are stainless steel sinks better than cast iron?

When most of us were kids the Cast Iron sink was a symbol of the typical American kitchen. Of late they have waned in popularity; possibly because of their heaviness and the cost of materials.

Stainless steel sinks and cast iron sinks are both capable of lasting a lifetime. Honestly the difference will be up to you, and will rely on your personal taste and cost point. Stainless steel is lighter, so the average customer will have no trouble carrying it to your car (cast iron sinks can weigh as much as 90lbs). Also cast iron sinks are coated with some sort of glaze resembling porcelain, which can chip on occasion.

Undermount, Topmount; what's the difference?

Topmount sinks, or Self-Rimming sinks as they are commonly referred to in the industry, are typically less expensive and are preferable for easy installation or for someone looking for a cheap fix. Many of these sinks are made of thin sheet metal and basically just drop into a hole in the countertop.

There are some advantages to having a self-rimming sink however; namely that in some cases they can be replaced by another model at a later date without too much difficulty. This is because most topmount kitchen sinks are 33"x22" (this measurement is from the outside of the sink, not the cutout size). Of course in most cases the proper thing to do in any respectable kitchen is to have an undermount sink.

Undermount sinks are literally mounted under the countertop, and the cutout in the stone will contour to the curves of the sink. Not only is this look attractive; but it actually increases the total counter space available for use, and they are typically deeper than self-rimming sinks.

Undermount sinks are usually made of a thicker stainless steel than are their topmount counterparts, mostly 18 or 16 gauge. Another difference is in the way that undermount sinks are attached to the countertop. The correct way to undermount a sink is to hang it in place, use sink mounting brackets, support blocks, silicone and epoxy. If done correctly you should be able to tap dance in your sink without any problem (not that I recommend it).

Where to buy a good sink, finding a deal.

I hope I do not anger the plethora of bargain shoppers out there, but probably the worst place to buy your sink is from eBay! Why is this? Do I have some grudge against the online marketplace giant?

No, for the most part I love eBay. I recommend against getting your sink there for the following reasons:

· Sinks from eBay may boast a low price, but there are hidden prices.

· Sinks from eBay usually have no model number (or at least one that can be found on the internet) and no web site or customer support. Fabricators care about this, believe me.

· Sinks from eBay often times come from shady producers, and consequently the geometry can be tough to follow. Somehow these sinks seem to break the laws of physics and actually have non-tangent curves. Some fabricators even charge more to figure out the cut-outs of these sinks because of the lack of consistency (you can buy the same sink off of eBay three times and each one will vary substantially).

The best solution: Find a sink with a recognized brand such as Kohler, Blanco, Moen, or American Standard. These companies have consistent geometry, functioning web sites and a fair price. To me it doesn't make sense to spend $4,000 or more on a new countertop and then try to save 40 bucks by shopping on eBay.

The big box stores like Home Depot and Lowes will have prices that will be competitive, let's leave the pricing of those items to the pros. If you are determined to find a good deal on a sink there are a number of ways to do it without sacrificing quality.

Many fabricators will run sales where they actually give away a free sink when you get your countertops done. This is often times worth waiting for since a decent sink can account for about 10% of your countertop bill.

Finding a deal like this ahead of time can be a big help. Usually you can lock in the free sink deal while the event is going on, even if you plan on getting your countertop done months later.

LG makes an engineered stone as well as a solid surface product, Hi-macs. I believe LG even gives away a sink all year round when you use their product (The sink has to be one of theirs and you have to spend a certain amount to qualify).

What about those composite sinks?

Composite sinks are often called "Granite Sinks." These sinks are made by a range of producers and usually come with a warranty (10 or 25 years). The warranty covers stains in the sink and physical malfunctions (like a crack).

Composite sinks can be a creative solution for your kitchen because while they are durable and come with a warranty they have another intrinsic advantage: they can come in colors other than that ever-so-familiar shiny silver color of stainless.

Composite sinks are made from quartz, resins and glues, coloring, and often some sort of polymer which I do not know the name of. They are worth mentioning since they provide more color matching options (often coming in white, off-white, black, gray or several other colors) which can help tie together the color scheme of your kitchen (matching with appliances, cabinets, flooring etc).

Kitchen Accessories on eBay

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Natural Stone (Granite) vs. Engineered Stone (Quartz)

Benefits, Cost, Application

Where do they come from?

Natural Stone is mined from the Earth and cut into slabs from what we refer to as "Blocks." Each slab in the series is fairly similar to the ones before and after it, much like a loaf of bread. Engineered stone are actually man-made, but contain 91%-97% natural constituents (AKA Quartz crystals). Engineered stones then have colors, binders, resins and other small ingredients added for color and consistency.

Producers

To my knowledge the only engineered stone that is actually made here in the good old USA is Cambria. Other producers of engineered stone include Silestone, Hanstone, Caesarstone, Zodiaq (owned by DuPont), and many others if you keep digging.

Are there differences between these producers that a homeowner would normally care about?

Yes! The two main differences between quartz and granite are that:

1. Granite is porous and quartz is not

2. Granite can have more variance than quartz (i.e. more movement)

Having a non-porous material in your kitchen is good for reasons of sanitation, since bacteria and viruses cannot penetrate into your kitchen countertop.

Granite on the other hand can have a wilder and indeed organic feel to it. See below.

Price

Depending on which company you buy your quartz from it can vary significantly of course, but generally engineered stone has a price point that is close to granite. Some colors of granite cost much more, some much less, but engineered stone in general is about equal in price to a mid-range granite slab.

Is there a difference in strength?

Yes there is. Engineered stone much stronger than granite, while at the same time being easier to shape. Granite tends to be more brittle due to some parts of the slab being denser and having higher or lower iron content in relation to the natural amount of quartz in the matrix. (There are probably many other reasons too, but I am not a geologist)

Drawbacks of quartz

The biggest complaint about quartz products is that if something does manage to scratch or somehow deface the surface of your countertop, it is almost impossible to repair. This is because engineered stones have a surfacing substance applied to them.

With granite it is possible to repair a chip or fill a scratch and to cover your tracks by surface polishing the material. Afterwards the repair can often be unnoticeable. This is something that is difficult or impossible with many engineered stones.

Drawbacks of Granite

Granite countertops occasionally need to be sealed because they are actually porous. Also over time each color of granite will tend to shift (get one shade darker or lighter, change hue slightly) as it is mined from deeper and deeper in the Earth. So if you ever wanted to replace a piece or add to your job, the odds become increasingly thinner and thinner of finding a good color match, even of the same color.

Leave a comment or question!

  • stonesmith Apr 21, 2011 @ 11:41 pm | delete
    any commercial interest is going to bend information in THEIR commercial interests. OMG as an an example "It would be a nightmare to educate and indeed explain to everyone in the production chain about all of the variances, and for the most part they are insignificant to the end user." Written by "granitguru". The truth...? The biggest thing facing consumers today is a lack of education. The truth...? The granite, ceasarstone. silestone. hanstone, etc., "salesman" has little if any experience or understanding of the product they are "recommending". Quartz products are manmade..., 90% of the so-called granites being sold are less utilitarian than "hardware store" arborite! Having no commercial interest... should one be interested in legitimate info on granite, quartz, laminate countertop materials... send a note to dsstonemith@gmail
  • stonesmith Apr 21, 2011 @ 11:41 pm | delete
    any commercial interest is going to bend information in THEIR commercial interests. OMG as an an example "It would be a nightmare to educate and indeed explain to everyone in the production chain about all of the variances, and for the most part they are insignificant to the end user." Written by "granitguru". The truth...? The biggest thing facing consumers today is a lack of education. The truth...? The granite, ceasarstone. silestone. hanstone, etc., "salesman" has little if any experience or understanding of the product they are "recommending". Quartz products are manmade..., 90% of the so-called granites being sold are less utilitarian than "hardware store" arborite! Having no commercial interest... should one be interested in legitimate info on granite, quartz, laminate countertop materials... send a note to dsstonemith@gmail
  • aaronz1 Dec 1, 2008 @ 10:22 pm | delete
    We had our granite countertop installed about 6 years ago and we don't have any complaints. The recent news about possible radon does cause a little concern and the granite, fabrication and installation wasn't cheap. If I was doing it over, I might consider other options. I ran across this site when looking for info on radon, pricing, and cleaning of granite. Good info for anyone who owns or is considering a granite countertop.

    Granite countertop info - pros & cons, maintenance and more
  • WritingforYourWealth Sep 22, 2008 @ 8:26 pm | delete
    I don't think you'll ever regret going with granite. I remodeled my condo and upgraded to it, and it's great (not just for looks, but it hides the crumbs well too :P)
  • Bob_Smith Aug 21, 2008 @ 12:34 am | delete
    Thanks for the informative article. I learned a lot!